Interview with: Mahmoud Hamdy
By: Alberto Marchioretto
While healing himself with healthy tomato juice, Egyptian artist Mahmoud Hamdy speaks about integration, swings and the psychotherapy that Noord needs.
How do you relate as an artist to the Noord (North Amsterdam) project?
I find the project very interesting. I have never worked with mapping before and I am discovering that it can really be a stimulating process. As long as you are mapping a specific place you are not only understanding things about the place in itself, you're understanding new things about yourself. Normally, when you visit a place, you just follow random patterns of interaction. It's only when you're mapping that you become aware of being a tourist exploring new spaces and of these patterns. I'm truly enjoying letting the tourist part of myself come out to explore Noord.
What has fascinated you about Noord and its relations with the city?
Coming from Cairo, where every movement within the city takes you at least one hour, I was very surprised by the mental distance which seems to exist amongst Amsterdammers of the centre and the people living in Noord. Even though it takes you only a three minutes long ferry trip, the imaginary gap in people’s mind appears to be way bigger.
Is this psychological distance part of your project?
In structuring my project, I imagine Noord as being a child. If a child has a certain type of complexity, you ought to look at and understand its parents in order to understand him or her. In this case Amsterdam is the parent and Noord is the neglected, abused child that needs a sort of psychoanalysis. I will try to graphically represent a historical timeline that analyzes the relations within this ‘dysfunctional family’. Thus, trying to find out what the key points are of the history of the city, which have shaped the relationship between the two parts. The outcome will be a moving, hopefully interactive, picture. I don’t like static mapping, in reality maps are anything but static, because the geography changes endlessly. Nothing is fixed when it comes to mapping.
As the other participants of Noord, you have been living in the neighbourhood since June. What inspires you in this borough?
At the beginning I was attracted by NDSM, because it is made to be attractive to artists and art lovers. However, after two months living there, I really appreciate the neighbourhood Van Der Pek, where we are staying. What I really like is the peculiar vibe that you can feel. In the monotonous of the housing - all being social houses, they're all alike - people are sitting outside in their swings, children are playing, doors are open. I love it!! Also, I am appreciating it more, because I believe that in no more than 10 years, with all the renovation plans that are going on, not so much of it will remain there probably.
What do you think about the gentrification that is taking place?
More money coming in means less village and more city vibe. Hence more tourists and potential customers will come pouring in. I see why the government and businesses see it as extremely positive, but do the Dutch families need and want it? I am not so sure. Government sees it as a good thing, the local population, however, as something bad. As an artist you stay in the middle, being aware of both the points of view. Nevertheless, for this project, I am taking the side of Noord all the way and will ,therefore, go in a direction that might even offend the people of Amsterdam. Be that as it may, I really sympathize with this ‘little child’ that was raised in a dysfunctional way and I want to point out the deficiencies of its parents.
The metro is an interesting project. It has been planned following only the axes north-south, completely ignoring the east-west of Noord. It is clear that it is not meant to serve Noord people to move faster. It is only trying to trick the psychological distance 't IJ creates between the city. No more ferry, no more changing of scenery.
You hear a lot about Noord being very multicultural. What have you noticed about integration when it comes to the immigrants from the different nationalities and the Dutch natives??
It really seems as such. Lots of races and religions living together without having any mayor problem. But is there real integration? Or is there mere tolerance? Are people only able to live together as long as they are not forced to interact? Politely neglecting each other more than harmoniously sharing their lives? I wonder!!
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